Getting fans to the Finals
Hey folks,
I've been mulling a few ideas lately about getting Storm fans to games out of town, particularly in the finals series.
During last years finals series, transport arrangements for fans during away games were a complete flop. We were left entirely to our own devices, at full cost. The club didn't organise buses except for the grand final, and even then the timetable they arranged was a bit odd and not too appealing. Also, since all the finals games are at night, you can't get from the game to the airport before the airport curfew, so you then have to find accomodation for the night and make your way back the following day.
On the other hand, a coach could get us there in semi-OK comfort, and, unlike scheduled air services, a coach could get us back overnight without paying extra for accomodation. Scheduled coach services also finish before the game is over, but a charter or special on the other hand.....
If a chartered coach was to be organised, it needs to be done with a view towards it being done for the 3rd week of the finals, with possible trips also on the 2nd and 4th weeks. It's almost a sure thing that we will be in the top 4 so the first week will be at home, and assuming we win the home final, we don't have to worry about the 2nd week (though if we do, we only would have a few days to organise everything).
Anyway, the question I'm posing is: Do you think you would pay $30-80ish a seat ($60-160 for a double) for a round trip to a night game in Sydney to travel with fellow storm supporters on a coach, if such a coach were to be organised?
- No, and it's a silly idea
- No, but it's a good idea in principle
- Maybe
-- For finals week 2 if storm were in it
-- For finals week 3
-- For the Grand Final if Storm were in it
-- For all of the above
- Count me in!
-- For finals week 2 if storm were in it
-- For finals week 3
-- For the Grand Final if Storm were in it
-- For all of the above
And if your answer is maybe or yes, an idea of how many seats you'd expect to book (please reply in this thread) would be useful
At a guess it'd cost something like $2100 for the round trip on a charter basis, not that I've yet gotten any quotes. That's just a guesstimate based on the following assumptions:
Drivers wages and employment costs at about $50 an hour
11 hours each way = $1100 (presumably split between 2 drivers)
Maybe $300 in fuel (??)
Kilometerage/maintenance allowances (maybe $300?)
Some allowance for cleaning when the coach gets back to Melbourne ($100?)
Profit for the operating company ($???)
That's about $2100
If we need to have two drivers on board during the entire trip, it'd be up around $3200, but I'm confident it can be done without that. They dont even do that for scheduled services anymore.
Assuming a single deck coach with 40 seats (20xdoubles) we'd want to charge $160 per double if we need 2 drivers or $105 per double if we can get by on 1 driver, assuming the quote above is accurate.
Assuming a double deck coach with 70 seats (35xdoubles) and the same operating costs, we'd want to charge about $92 per double if we need 2 drivers or $60 per double.
Half the above prices if you're travelling alone and don't mind taking pot luck with who you get seated next to.
And, of course, if my quote is inaccurate, the fares would need to be completely rejigged.
Oh, and there'd need to be a balance between those who want to sleep on the trip home and those who want to enjoy being drunk and with fellow storm fans. It'd be especially good to get a double deck coach. Assuming those who want sleep stay upstairs and those who want to drink stay downstairs, or vice versa, it should work out quite nicely. Perhaps a preference could be indicated on the booking form
This isn't a concrete proposal. It's just raising the flag, thinking out loud about how it'd work, and hopefully (assuming anyone replies) getting an idea of whether I should bother to give the idea any more thought, or whether I should just book my own airfares and accommodation.
Some other assumptions on how it'd work in practice are below:
Assumption 1: Semi Finals and Preliminary Finals are scheduled for 7.45pm on Friday and Saturday nights, same as last year. Corresponding coach trips would involve leaving Melbourne 7.30am-ish Friday or Saturday morning, returning 8.45am the following morning.
Assumption 2: The Grand Final is scheduled for 7.15pm on a Sunday night. A departure from Melbourne would need to be at 7am on the Sunday Morning. Public Transport in Melbourne does not run that early on a Sunday, so the coach would presumably need to leave from someplace where forty or so cars can park safely for 24 hours, or it instead ought to be scheduled to leave on the Saturday night circa Midnight to arrive in Sydney in time for lunch and all the pre-game festivities. It'd presumably still return to Melbourne within the hour following the game.
Assumption 3: It's an 883km trip, and with the exception of the bit from Spencer Street to the Dynon Road on-ramp and from the M5-King Georges Road to the Stadium, it's all via freeways or high speed highways. Assuming a 45 min lunch stop (i.e. for the driver) at somewhere like Gundagai or Yass, and 2x15 minute smokos at some fast food store eg at Albury and Pheasants Nest, with the rest of the trip spent pretty much at 100km/h, that's about 10h15m in theory or 10h45m in practice. We'd probably board the coach and get rolling at 10pm and would arrive back in Melbourne circa 8.15am-8.45am the next morning.
Assumption 4: If you're going to spend 21 hours during a 25 hour window on board a coach, you'd not really want to spend that long next to a total stranger. For those making bookings, you'd suggest that people book 2 seats whether travelling alone or with a companion (partner/child).
Assumption 5: After getting a quote for this, I'd still need to investigate what insurance I'd need. Alternately, if it were to be run under the quoting company's own banner their own insurance would be sufficient. After getting a quote, I could come back to them with a suggestion that they run the service, they stick an ad for it on their website under "Specials", with the fares quoted being something along the lines of what I quoted above, and:
- In the event of the service not having enough passengers to fill a single coach, I'll cover the shortfall between revenue (minus merchant fees for credit cards etc) and the cost they quoted me to run the service as a charter
- If in the event of a single coach being filled to x seats, I'm absolved from contributing, and they start a waitlist and start filling multiple coaches on the same timetable and fare structure, keeping the profits for themselves
On that last point, since running coaches from state to state is their bread and butter, they'd easily be able to take on that sort of thing. For the coach operator it'd be a win win assuming they have their own or can contract on staff and vehicles for the runs.
For me I'd be taking a minor risk but finding 70 fans out of the ten thousand who trek to the Graveyard 12 times a year to fill that first coach shouldn't be that hard.
For everyone who'd participate, we'd get 10 hours there watching reruns of last year's finals or whatever people are inclined to watch on the on-board DVD player, or reminiscing, or otherwise getting along (hopefully not too drunk but you never know), followed by our finals footy fix, followed by a merry victorious homecoming surrounded by other storm fans.
And for the club, they'd get dozens and possibly hundreds of extra screaming fans there on the night.
To me doing something like this just makes sense, assuming there's actually any interest, hence the post. Any comments or feedback would be much appreciated.
I've been mulling a few ideas lately about getting Storm fans to games out of town, particularly in the finals series.
During last years finals series, transport arrangements for fans during away games were a complete flop. We were left entirely to our own devices, at full cost. The club didn't organise buses except for the grand final, and even then the timetable they arranged was a bit odd and not too appealing. Also, since all the finals games are at night, you can't get from the game to the airport before the airport curfew, so you then have to find accomodation for the night and make your way back the following day.
On the other hand, a coach could get us there in semi-OK comfort, and, unlike scheduled air services, a coach could get us back overnight without paying extra for accomodation. Scheduled coach services also finish before the game is over, but a charter or special on the other hand.....
If a chartered coach was to be organised, it needs to be done with a view towards it being done for the 3rd week of the finals, with possible trips also on the 2nd and 4th weeks. It's almost a sure thing that we will be in the top 4 so the first week will be at home, and assuming we win the home final, we don't have to worry about the 2nd week (though if we do, we only would have a few days to organise everything).
Anyway, the question I'm posing is: Do you think you would pay $30-80ish a seat ($60-160 for a double) for a round trip to a night game in Sydney to travel with fellow storm supporters on a coach, if such a coach were to be organised?
- No, and it's a silly idea
- No, but it's a good idea in principle
- Maybe
-- For finals week 2 if storm were in it
-- For finals week 3
-- For the Grand Final if Storm were in it
-- For all of the above
- Count me in!
-- For finals week 2 if storm were in it
-- For finals week 3
-- For the Grand Final if Storm were in it
-- For all of the above
And if your answer is maybe or yes, an idea of how many seats you'd expect to book (please reply in this thread) would be useful
At a guess it'd cost something like $2100 for the round trip on a charter basis, not that I've yet gotten any quotes. That's just a guesstimate based on the following assumptions:
Drivers wages and employment costs at about $50 an hour
11 hours each way = $1100 (presumably split between 2 drivers)
Maybe $300 in fuel (??)
Kilometerage/maintenance allowances (maybe $300?)
Some allowance for cleaning when the coach gets back to Melbourne ($100?)
Profit for the operating company ($???)
That's about $2100
If we need to have two drivers on board during the entire trip, it'd be up around $3200, but I'm confident it can be done without that. They dont even do that for scheduled services anymore.
Assuming a single deck coach with 40 seats (20xdoubles) we'd want to charge $160 per double if we need 2 drivers or $105 per double if we can get by on 1 driver, assuming the quote above is accurate.
Assuming a double deck coach with 70 seats (35xdoubles) and the same operating costs, we'd want to charge about $92 per double if we need 2 drivers or $60 per double.
Half the above prices if you're travelling alone and don't mind taking pot luck with who you get seated next to.
And, of course, if my quote is inaccurate, the fares would need to be completely rejigged.
Oh, and there'd need to be a balance between those who want to sleep on the trip home and those who want to enjoy being drunk and with fellow storm fans. It'd be especially good to get a double deck coach. Assuming those who want sleep stay upstairs and those who want to drink stay downstairs, or vice versa, it should work out quite nicely. Perhaps a preference could be indicated on the booking form
This isn't a concrete proposal. It's just raising the flag, thinking out loud about how it'd work, and hopefully (assuming anyone replies) getting an idea of whether I should bother to give the idea any more thought, or whether I should just book my own airfares and accommodation.
Some other assumptions on how it'd work in practice are below:
Assumption 1: Semi Finals and Preliminary Finals are scheduled for 7.45pm on Friday and Saturday nights, same as last year. Corresponding coach trips would involve leaving Melbourne 7.30am-ish Friday or Saturday morning, returning 8.45am the following morning.
Assumption 2: The Grand Final is scheduled for 7.15pm on a Sunday night. A departure from Melbourne would need to be at 7am on the Sunday Morning. Public Transport in Melbourne does not run that early on a Sunday, so the coach would presumably need to leave from someplace where forty or so cars can park safely for 24 hours, or it instead ought to be scheduled to leave on the Saturday night circa Midnight to arrive in Sydney in time for lunch and all the pre-game festivities. It'd presumably still return to Melbourne within the hour following the game.
Assumption 3: It's an 883km trip, and with the exception of the bit from Spencer Street to the Dynon Road on-ramp and from the M5-King Georges Road to the Stadium, it's all via freeways or high speed highways. Assuming a 45 min lunch stop (i.e. for the driver) at somewhere like Gundagai or Yass, and 2x15 minute smokos at some fast food store eg at Albury and Pheasants Nest, with the rest of the trip spent pretty much at 100km/h, that's about 10h15m in theory or 10h45m in practice. We'd probably board the coach and get rolling at 10pm and would arrive back in Melbourne circa 8.15am-8.45am the next morning.
Assumption 4: If you're going to spend 21 hours during a 25 hour window on board a coach, you'd not really want to spend that long next to a total stranger. For those making bookings, you'd suggest that people book 2 seats whether travelling alone or with a companion (partner/child).
Assumption 5: After getting a quote for this, I'd still need to investigate what insurance I'd need. Alternately, if it were to be run under the quoting company's own banner their own insurance would be sufficient. After getting a quote, I could come back to them with a suggestion that they run the service, they stick an ad for it on their website under "Specials", with the fares quoted being something along the lines of what I quoted above, and:
- In the event of the service not having enough passengers to fill a single coach, I'll cover the shortfall between revenue (minus merchant fees for credit cards etc) and the cost they quoted me to run the service as a charter
- If in the event of a single coach being filled to x seats, I'm absolved from contributing, and they start a waitlist and start filling multiple coaches on the same timetable and fare structure, keeping the profits for themselves
On that last point, since running coaches from state to state is their bread and butter, they'd easily be able to take on that sort of thing. For the coach operator it'd be a win win assuming they have their own or can contract on staff and vehicles for the runs.
For me I'd be taking a minor risk but finding 70 fans out of the ten thousand who trek to the Graveyard 12 times a year to fill that first coach shouldn't be that hard.
For everyone who'd participate, we'd get 10 hours there watching reruns of last year's finals or whatever people are inclined to watch on the on-board DVD player, or reminiscing, or otherwise getting along (hopefully not too drunk but you never know), followed by our finals footy fix, followed by a merry victorious homecoming surrounded by other storm fans.
And for the club, they'd get dozens and possibly hundreds of extra screaming fans there on the night.
To me doing something like this just makes sense, assuming there's actually any interest, hence the post. Any comments or feedback would be much appreciated.
Last edited by mrpc on Fri Apr 20, 2007 2:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
Stormin North Queanbeyan!
Wow... that has to be the longest original post ever submitted! Noice!
Assuming we're top of the ladder, we would see Week 1 in Melbourne (@OP), and assuming we win, we'd see Week 3 in Melbourne (@TD OR MCG) also. So if all goes to plan, the only trip we'd need to make would be in week 4. If costs are already worked out, and it's advertised in advance, and people can make provisional bookings before hand - and of course assuming all goes well on the field - I reckon you'd be able to get upwards of 5 coaches to the grand final.
Might even be able to come up with some options:
Melbourne - Sydney:
Option A: Depart Melbourne 10pm Saturday night, arrive early morning Sunday
Option B: Depart Melbourne 6am Sunday, arrive Sydney 5pm
Sydney - Melbourne:
Option A: Depart Sydney 11pm Sunday night, arrive 10am Monday
Option B: Accomodation in Sydney Sunday night, depart Sydney 9am Monday, arrive Melbourne 8pm.
With those kinds of options and flexibility and with us confirmed in the Grand Final, I'm sure the faithful will flock!
Would also need Club co-operation to allow for tickets to be sold with the travel arrangements out of Club allocations. That way you'd be able to get people to sign up knowing they can get into the game as well as get to the game.
Finally - regarding the alcohol on the bus - many operators will not allow that for various reasons and excuses. Back in the MSSC days, they used a bus company where a relationship was formed with the driver, who turned a bit of an eye away from a can or three. Also with negotiation with that company, we had a "Venga Bus" for one game that it was agreed to have drinking and music and other stuff ALL NIGHT LONG. It went okay - but getting the permission of the bus driver and company might be an issue.
Noice!Assuming we're top of the ladder, we would see Week 1 in Melbourne (@OP), and assuming we win, we'd see Week 3 in Melbourne (@TD OR MCG) also. So if all goes to plan, the only trip we'd need to make would be in week 4. If costs are already worked out, and it's advertised in advance, and people can make provisional bookings before hand - and of course assuming all goes well on the field - I reckon you'd be able to get upwards of 5 coaches to the grand final.
Might even be able to come up with some options:
Melbourne - Sydney:
Option A: Depart Melbourne 10pm Saturday night, arrive early morning Sunday
Option B: Depart Melbourne 6am Sunday, arrive Sydney 5pm
Sydney - Melbourne:
Option A: Depart Sydney 11pm Sunday night, arrive 10am Monday
Option B: Accomodation in Sydney Sunday night, depart Sydney 9am Monday, arrive Melbourne 8pm.
With those kinds of options and flexibility and with us confirmed in the Grand Final, I'm sure the faithful will flock!
Would also need Club co-operation to allow for tickets to be sold with the travel arrangements out of Club allocations. That way you'd be able to get people to sign up knowing they can get into the game as well as get to the game.
Finally - regarding the alcohol on the bus - many operators will not allow that for various reasons and excuses. Back in the MSSC days, they used a bus company where a relationship was formed with the driver, who turned a bit of an eye away from a can or three. Also with negotiation with that company, we had a "Venga Bus" for one game that it was agreed to have drinking and music and other stuff ALL NIGHT LONG. It went okay - but getting the permission of the bus driver and company might be an issue.
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Silkin Storm
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I think you mean niceBuzz wrote: Wow... that has to be the longest original post ever submitted!
And here i was thinking how many credits it would gather LOL
Don't Leave it to Fate
She's a Fickle Bitch
She's a Fickle Bitch
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Having put together all of the 99 away supporters travel all I can say is good luck.
Unfortunately getting the people to commit is the hardest part and you need to base your prices on the lowest possible number of people attending to be able to run the trip/s at break even as a minimum. A number of times we had two or three buses ready to go based on bookings only for people to pull out because the boys had a couple of shocking games, leaving you high and dry.
You also need to consider insurance, as if you go over a certain amount $ wise in bookings you must have;
1) a travel agents license in Victoria (which also means that you must be part of the Agent insurance system which cost $10,000)
2) then as co-coordinator you may need to look at Public Liability Insurance
Unfortunately getting the people to commit is the hardest part and you need to base your prices on the lowest possible number of people attending to be able to run the trip/s at break even as a minimum. A number of times we had two or three buses ready to go based on bookings only for people to pull out because the boys had a couple of shocking games, leaving you high and dry.
You also need to consider insurance, as if you go over a certain amount $ wise in bookings you must have;
1) a travel agents license in Victoria (which also means that you must be part of the Agent insurance system which cost $10,000)
2) then as co-coordinator you may need to look at Public Liability Insurance
[img]http://farm1.static.flickr.com/199/454935051_b6f97f0eb1.jpg[/img]
[b]Get out of the closet, you know deep down your a Storm supporter.[/b]
[b]You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life....[b]
[b]Get out of the closet, you know deep down your a Storm supporter.[/b]
[b]You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life....[b]
I would definaltely be interested in that, last year i drove up for the finals and it would be good to have other storm supporters on my trip.
Go the mighty storm.
I reckon we take a look at Ratty's charter flight thing - was being nosey last nite & it looks quite feasible (well if you're interested in paying heaps - around $600, depending on the craft) to go up and back in the one day with you (I'd presume) choosing times etc 
But not being at the mercy of Virgin, Jetstar et al makes it even more enticing - also Moorabbin airport is just across the road from me
Wouldn't mind finding out the price of a bigger one either - they even have planes for about 98 passengers - we could be very surprised ..................
But not being at the mercy of Virgin, Jetstar et al makes it even more enticing - also Moorabbin airport is just across the road from me Wouldn't mind finding out the price of a bigger one either - they even have planes for about 98 passengers - we could be very surprised ..................
When I want your opinion - I'll give it to you!
$600 would buy you a very nice hotel room, so there'd be no cost saving. It'd just be about convenience. It'd still be way cool though
(Of course, we'd not only have to pay for the time our plane spends in the air, but the positioning movements. Moorabbin Airport or Essendon Airport would be fine if we chartered a plane that was already based there, but if not, we'd have to pay to get the plane there, and to get it home after we disembark)
Also, Buzz, you suggested that Finals week 3 could be held in Melbourne. Has that changed since last year (where one game was at the SFS and the other at Homebush Bay)?
If we're really only talking about the GF, then that makes it a bit harder to plan a bus trip, especially since people might feel squeamish about leaving their cars at some railway station for 25 hours and since there's no public transport in Melbourne at 7am on a Sunday. If we really only have to worry about the GF, then I see two options that'd be worthwhile:
Option 1: Depart Melbourne circa Midnight-12.30am Sunday, arrive Homebush Bay circa Noon. The Pre-Game entertainment starts around then, and those who want to give it a miss and/or get a train to Lidcombe, Strathfield etc to get a proper lunch or do something in Sydney still have 6-7 hours to do just that. The game would finish circa 9pm, the coach could leave Homebush Bay circa 10-10.15ish, and arrive back in Melbourne at 8-9am Monday in time for a slightly dissheveled almost on time start for those who have to work in the CBD on the Monday morning.
Option 2: Suggest people make their own way to Sydney. Charter a plane for a one way trip SYD-MEL (or Bankstown-MEL, or Bankstown-Essendon, or Bankstown-Moorabbin) departing at 11pm-ish.
(Of course, we'd not only have to pay for the time our plane spends in the air, but the positioning movements. Moorabbin Airport or Essendon Airport would be fine if we chartered a plane that was already based there, but if not, we'd have to pay to get the plane there, and to get it home after we disembark)
Also, Buzz, you suggested that Finals week 3 could be held in Melbourne. Has that changed since last year (where one game was at the SFS and the other at Homebush Bay)?
If we're really only talking about the GF, then that makes it a bit harder to plan a bus trip, especially since people might feel squeamish about leaving their cars at some railway station for 25 hours and since there's no public transport in Melbourne at 7am on a Sunday. If we really only have to worry about the GF, then I see two options that'd be worthwhile:
Option 1: Depart Melbourne circa Midnight-12.30am Sunday, arrive Homebush Bay circa Noon. The Pre-Game entertainment starts around then, and those who want to give it a miss and/or get a train to Lidcombe, Strathfield etc to get a proper lunch or do something in Sydney still have 6-7 hours to do just that. The game would finish circa 9pm, the coach could leave Homebush Bay circa 10-10.15ish, and arrive back in Melbourne at 8-9am Monday in time for a slightly dissheveled almost on time start for those who have to work in the CBD on the Monday morning.
Option 2: Suggest people make their own way to Sydney. Charter a plane for a one way trip SYD-MEL (or Bankstown-MEL, or Bankstown-Essendon, or Bankstown-Moorabbin) departing at 11pm-ish.
Stormin North Queanbeyan!
You may need to leave a little later after the game so as we can enjoy the after-party festivities. 
If ants are such busy workers,
how come they find time to go to all the picnics?
how come they find time to go to all the picnics?
If you charter are you obliged to follow the same rules as the 'big' planes at Mascot? If so, I'm sure there's a little airport around Sydney - somewhere - where we could leave later, I know the plane's are flying round here til pretty lateRabble_1 wrote: You may need to leave a little later after the game so as we can enjoy the after-party festivities.
When I want your opinion - I'll give it to you!
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Bankstown have the same rules.......That means NO fight can leave after 10.30pm....no matter who you are, even the PM.
The only airport that can leave after that time is in the bush or the air force.
It also means you miss the party :)being held by the players and supporters
The only airport that can leave after that time is in the bush or the air force.
It also means you miss the party :)being held by the players and supporters
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[b]Get out of the closet, you know deep down your a Storm supporter.[/b]
[b]You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life....[b]
[b]Get out of the closet, you know deep down your a Storm supporter.[/b]
[b]You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life....[b]
Bah, I'll just be happy to be there either way - I still think a charter flight would be just such coolie fun tho 
Anyway, we'll have somewhere to stay - I'm pretty sure .............................
Anyway, we'll have somewhere to stay - I'm pretty sure .............................
When I want your opinion - I'll give it to you!
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Bourbon Rat
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Sydney Airport Curfew ActTigger wrote:If you charter are you obliged to follow the same rules as the 'big' planes at Mascot? If so, I'm sure there's a little airport around Sydney - somewhere - where we could leave later, I know the plane's are flying round here til pretty lateRabble_1 wrote: You may need to leave a little later after the game so as we can enjoy the after-party festivities.
I only threw up Mel Air coz they're reasonable.
You might want to look at Tradewinds out of Sydney
I think both Metro III turbo prop & Westwind jet aircraft operate outside of the Curfew act
Last edited by Bourbon Rat on Fri Apr 20, 2007 9:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Always carry a flagon of whiskey in case of snakebite and furthermore always carry a small snake - WC Fields
mrpc - the rules regarding home finals have changed. Week 1 is the home venue. Weeks 2 and 3 are home state but at a venue with a larger capacity (+25,000).
So presuming we finish top again, and win week 1 at home, we'd be entitled to a home prelim final in Melbourne, possibly Dome or if we really feel confident, the G again...Hmmm... 70 - 10... I could handle that!
So presuming we finish top again, and win week 1 at home, we'd be entitled to a home prelim final in Melbourne, possibly Dome or if we really feel confident, the G again...Hmmm... 70 - 10... I could handle that!
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The PM's flight,(aka "Commonwealth One") is normally a RAAF designated aircraftStormwarning[c] wrote: Bankstown have the same rules.......That means NO fight can leave after 10.30pm....no matter who you are, even the PM.
The only airport that can leave after that time is in the bush or the air force.
It also means you miss the party :)being held by the players and supporters
Always carry a flagon of whiskey in case of snakebite and furthermore always carry a small snake - WC Fields