An honest assessment
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Papenhuyzen23
- Hail Storm
- Posts: 426
- Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2023 12:40 am
Hey guys, long time follower and finally had to sign up to have my say on the 2023 season.
First of all, I am going to point out mostly negatives but it doesn’t mean I think we have been poor overall, we have shown some really bright spots at times but these are just a few issues I’ve noticed and I’d like to hear some other Storm fans opinions on these points.
Meaney - Been great, very solid and whilst he lacks the X-factor of Paps he has been awesome for us and we lacked cohesion without him against Manly.
Warbrick - Still finding his feet but doing ok, got a few errors in him but he tries hard, needs to up his involvement using that big frame coming out of trouble though.
Smith - Been ok without spectacular, for a starting centre in the NRL he rarely creates any chances, needs to up his attacking threat and try to get more points on the board for the team but his defence has improved since last year for sure.
Olam - No one wants to have this conversation but he has been abysmal, I think his broken arm is still affecting him because he is always carrying it in and odd way when he runs the ball, never uses it to fend or play the ball it’s definitely hindering him, after every run he looks gassed and just broken, maybe the style he plays has caught up with him but he is just no threat at the moment, looks old and unable to compete at this level hopefully we see the old Justin soon as when he’s on he is devastating.
Coates - He just isn’t kicking on like I thought, he is so weak brings the ball out of trouble gets dominated every time, for all his aerials skills he never creates any chances, usually just runs himself into trouble and wastes a tackle, he was awful against Manly one of the worst games I’ve seen from him, just not sure he is going to be the elite guy we all hoped for.
Munster - Our best player and has had a great year, was bad against Manly at fullback but he never stopped trying, I think he needs to stay at 6 moving forward and just concentrate on working that left side and developing his combinations on that side, needs to think run first that’s when he is best.
Hughes - Wow, another hard conversation to have, he has been abysmal all year, no threat running, crap defence crap kicking game, usually takes a useless run on the 4th so he can’t put in an attacking kick, brain snaps and just rubbish really, been so poor I’m not sure what we can do about it, will he come good? I hope so.
Welch - Has been ok but as captain he really just doesn’t inspire anything. No where near vocal enough, never gees the boys up or gets up anyone, never throws the team on his back or shows game turning aggression, just goes through the motions most the time, wrong choice for captain I believe.
Grant - Has been phenomenal this year, but really over played his hand vs Manly, needs to stick to bringing forwards onto the ball, running from dummy half more to create doubt in the defensive line and leave the kicking for the halves, he tries to play 3 positions at once and tonight just made mistake after mistake, we can forgive one shocker but Harry is much better than what he showed tonight.
Tui - Looks like Tarzan plays like Jane, not sure he deserves a spot in our rotation once NAS, Moeroa etc return, doesn’t bend the line, doesn’t offer any second phase and just plods around with no real impact, needs to lift.
Trent - Awful, either a lazy penalty, a stupid offload, the guy is no threat, he makes a fair few tackles and tries to run the ball his fair share but there’s just no impact, never hits the gaps, never knows how to create momentum, is slow in the ruck and just doesn’t look cut out for an 80 minute NRL second rower, maybe Howarth, Chan or Eisenhuth need to get a shot there?
Katoa - was quiet against Manly but has been very good I think, he is a threat, works hard, busts the line and is one of the better players this year, exciting to see how he can improve.
King - Another that was quiet against Manly but has been phenomenal, exceeded all my expectation this season, always puts in effort and shows pride in the jersey, does alot of the dirty work and can’t complain about his form.
Garlick - has been ok but isn’t much of an impact, would we be better with a more electric bench player? Sua maybe?
McDonald - tries hard and gets involved but just doesn’t offer much, is awkward and always looks like he is about to make a mistake, gets pinged for a lot of discipline issue as well, not sure he is first grade level either.
Sims - been pretty average, not as much impact as I’d hoped but he also hasn’t got a lot of minutes, coming off injury I’ll give the benefit of the doubt until a few more games in to judge.
Eisenhuth - Was really impressed with him vs Manly, might not always be flashy but he is a tough awkward player who can create, maybe give him a start in the pack?
Overall I think we have been ok to start the year, when we are on like vs South’s and Roosters we were great but there’s been games where we really look like we just can’t be bothered, lazy efforts and no real urgency to turn a game that’s not going smoothly, vs Bulldogs and Manly especially we just waited for someone else to do the hard work and create something, overall I think Olam, Coates, Hughes, Tui, Trent all really need to lift, obviously with Paps and NAS coming back in soon we get a lot of star power back, but it’s really an attitude adjustment we need, drifting out of games this early in the season is worrying and I’m not sure we are in the for the grind, 20 rounds til the finals and we look spent already, thoughts?
First of all, I am going to point out mostly negatives but it doesn’t mean I think we have been poor overall, we have shown some really bright spots at times but these are just a few issues I’ve noticed and I’d like to hear some other Storm fans opinions on these points.
Meaney - Been great, very solid and whilst he lacks the X-factor of Paps he has been awesome for us and we lacked cohesion without him against Manly.
Warbrick - Still finding his feet but doing ok, got a few errors in him but he tries hard, needs to up his involvement using that big frame coming out of trouble though.
Smith - Been ok without spectacular, for a starting centre in the NRL he rarely creates any chances, needs to up his attacking threat and try to get more points on the board for the team but his defence has improved since last year for sure.
Olam - No one wants to have this conversation but he has been abysmal, I think his broken arm is still affecting him because he is always carrying it in and odd way when he runs the ball, never uses it to fend or play the ball it’s definitely hindering him, after every run he looks gassed and just broken, maybe the style he plays has caught up with him but he is just no threat at the moment, looks old and unable to compete at this level hopefully we see the old Justin soon as when he’s on he is devastating.
Coates - He just isn’t kicking on like I thought, he is so weak brings the ball out of trouble gets dominated every time, for all his aerials skills he never creates any chances, usually just runs himself into trouble and wastes a tackle, he was awful against Manly one of the worst games I’ve seen from him, just not sure he is going to be the elite guy we all hoped for.
Munster - Our best player and has had a great year, was bad against Manly at fullback but he never stopped trying, I think he needs to stay at 6 moving forward and just concentrate on working that left side and developing his combinations on that side, needs to think run first that’s when he is best.
Hughes - Wow, another hard conversation to have, he has been abysmal all year, no threat running, crap defence crap kicking game, usually takes a useless run on the 4th so he can’t put in an attacking kick, brain snaps and just rubbish really, been so poor I’m not sure what we can do about it, will he come good? I hope so.
Welch - Has been ok but as captain he really just doesn’t inspire anything. No where near vocal enough, never gees the boys up or gets up anyone, never throws the team on his back or shows game turning aggression, just goes through the motions most the time, wrong choice for captain I believe.
Grant - Has been phenomenal this year, but really over played his hand vs Manly, needs to stick to bringing forwards onto the ball, running from dummy half more to create doubt in the defensive line and leave the kicking for the halves, he tries to play 3 positions at once and tonight just made mistake after mistake, we can forgive one shocker but Harry is much better than what he showed tonight.
Tui - Looks like Tarzan plays like Jane, not sure he deserves a spot in our rotation once NAS, Moeroa etc return, doesn’t bend the line, doesn’t offer any second phase and just plods around with no real impact, needs to lift.
Trent - Awful, either a lazy penalty, a stupid offload, the guy is no threat, he makes a fair few tackles and tries to run the ball his fair share but there’s just no impact, never hits the gaps, never knows how to create momentum, is slow in the ruck and just doesn’t look cut out for an 80 minute NRL second rower, maybe Howarth, Chan or Eisenhuth need to get a shot there?
Katoa - was quiet against Manly but has been very good I think, he is a threat, works hard, busts the line and is one of the better players this year, exciting to see how he can improve.
King - Another that was quiet against Manly but has been phenomenal, exceeded all my expectation this season, always puts in effort and shows pride in the jersey, does alot of the dirty work and can’t complain about his form.
Garlick - has been ok but isn’t much of an impact, would we be better with a more electric bench player? Sua maybe?
McDonald - tries hard and gets involved but just doesn’t offer much, is awkward and always looks like he is about to make a mistake, gets pinged for a lot of discipline issue as well, not sure he is first grade level either.
Sims - been pretty average, not as much impact as I’d hoped but he also hasn’t got a lot of minutes, coming off injury I’ll give the benefit of the doubt until a few more games in to judge.
Eisenhuth - Was really impressed with him vs Manly, might not always be flashy but he is a tough awkward player who can create, maybe give him a start in the pack?
Overall I think we have been ok to start the year, when we are on like vs South’s and Roosters we were great but there’s been games where we really look like we just can’t be bothered, lazy efforts and no real urgency to turn a game that’s not going smoothly, vs Bulldogs and Manly especially we just waited for someone else to do the hard work and create something, overall I think Olam, Coates, Hughes, Tui, Trent all really need to lift, obviously with Paps and NAS coming back in soon we get a lot of star power back, but it’s really an attitude adjustment we need, drifting out of games this early in the season is worrying and I’m not sure we are in the for the grind, 20 rounds til the finals and we look spent already, thoughts?
Don't agree with everything said but there are a few players who need a proper wakeup call.
Seeing the difference between the two halfbacks last night really illustrates how out of form Jahrome has been for awhile now. I thought during the middle of last season he picked up a few injuries that may have been the reason for his deep in form but he's not set the world alight this season either. He's lost a bit of speed and not playing with a lot of intelligence out there. His and the teams kicking game remains awful too.
Seeing the difference between the two halfbacks last night really illustrates how out of form Jahrome has been for awhile now. I thought during the middle of last season he picked up a few injuries that may have been the reason for his deep in form but he's not set the world alight this season either. He's lost a bit of speed and not playing with a lot of intelligence out there. His and the teams kicking game remains awful too.
Welcome aboard Papenhuyzen, intelligent conversation is welcomed here. I'll add my my two penneth worth to each of your summations and see what you think.
Overall, I think coaching styles evolve, maybe ours hasn't? Lack of depth maybe an issue but we rarely bring players back through the reserves and I think this is a failing.
Papenhuyzen23 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 1:12 am Hey guys, long time follower and finally had to sign up to have my say on the 2023 season.
First of all, I am going to point out mostly negatives but it doesn’t mean I think we have been poor overall, we have shown some really bright spots at times but these are just a few issues I’ve noticed and I’d like to hear some other Storm fans opinions on these points.
Meaney - Been great, very solid and whilst he lacks the X-factor of Paps he has been awesome for us and we lacked cohesion without him against Manly.
I think he's finally gelling with the "team" and agree wholeheartedly with the confidence. It must be very hard to come in as a back up player all the time
Warbrick - Still finding his feet but doing ok, got a few errors in him but he tries hard, needs to up his involvement using that big frame coming out of trouble though.
Big fan of young Will, defence and attack and can only go onwards and up
Smith - Been ok without spectacular, for a starting centre in the NRL he rarely creates any chances, needs to up his attacking threat and try to get more points on the board for the team but his defence has improved since last year for sure.
Mightn't create a lot in attack but his defence is outstanding, get's his man every time and his decisions are usually very good (especially when the wing is left high and dry with the middle players not shifting across. I think his conversation with his winger must be excellent.
Olam - No one wants to have this conversation but he has been abysmal, I think his broken arm is still affecting him because he is always carrying it in and odd way when he runs the ball, never uses it to fend or play the ball it’s definitely hindering him, after every run he looks gassed and just broken, maybe the style he plays has caught up with him but he is just no threat at the moment, looks old and unable to compete at this level hopefully we see the old Justin soon as when he’s on he is devastating.
Agreed 100%, no argument from me
Coates - He just isn’t kicking on like I thought, he is so weak brings the ball out of trouble gets dominated every time, for all his aerials skills he never creates any chances, usually just runs himself into trouble and wastes a tackle, he was awful against Manly one of the worst games I’ve seen from him, just not sure he is going to be the elite guy we all hoped for.
Agreed again, runs to upright everytime and gets push back too often
Munster - Our best player and has had a great year, was bad against Manly at fullback but he never stopped trying, I think he needs to stay at 6 moving forward and just concentrate on working that left side and developing his combinations on that side, needs to think run first that’s when he is best.
Munster is not a fullbacks asrehole, can't run and can't tackle and doesn't know where to be as was evidenced friday night. His one up tackling is very hit and miss, and unfortunately more miss. He plays for the ball and we all laud it when it comes off but I don't reckon he's made a single strip all year. Every missed tackle is much more telling. (Kinda like Rodney Howe shooting out of the line to make a big hit, it came off once every 2 or 3 games but was otherwise a liability)
Hughes - Wow, another hard conversation to have, he has been abysmal all year, no threat running, crap defence crap kicking game, usually takes a useless run on the 4th so he can’t put in an attacking kick, brain snaps and just rubbish really, been so poor I’m not sure what we can do about it, will he come good? I hope so.
Yes and no. If the teams goign ok he's going ok, team goes backwards, well, we know the rest. Yes, runs way too often. One up tackling is better then Munster, he, if not stops at least slows the player until the cavalry arrives, Munster is a turnstile. Also, game plan is (I feel) against Hughes. An early grubber kick to the corner when the wingers are up or a chip (as was so effective by DCE) throws doubt in to the defence's minds. This is I think on the coaching staff, structure is the coaches game plan (and hey, it's been effective for a very long time), off the cuff is not
Welch - Has been ok but as captain he really just doesn’t inspire anything. No where near vocal enough, never gees the boys up or gets up anyone, never throws the team on his back or shows game turning aggression, just goes through the motions most the time, wrong choice for captain I believe.
I was all for him as captain (and still am - maybe though due to lack of suitable alternatives?) I thought he looked tentative in the first few rounds (as you are coming back from major injury) but he started to look like more of a presence. Unfortunately everyone knows he likes an offload, maybe he can use that to his advantage and shelve the play and go forward more
Grant - Has been phenomenal this year, but really over played his hand vs Manly, needs to stick to bringing forwards onto the ball, running from dummy half more to create doubt in the defensive line and leave the kicking for the halves, he tries to play 3 positions at once and tonight just made mistake after mistake, we can forgive one shocker but Harry is much better than what he showed tonight.
Enough said
Tui - Looks like Tarzan plays like Jane, not sure he deserves a spot in our rotation once NAS, Moeroa etc return, doesn’t bend the line, doesn’t offer any second phase and just plods around with no real impact, needs to lift.
Yes, Tarzan and Jane, NAS hopefully can come back and realise he's a big boy. Everyone loves Tepai (and who could forget the Warriors game last year), me, I'm not so sold. That Warriors game he was superb but it was against a very badly beaten side
Trent - Awful, either a lazy penalty, a stupid offload, the guy is no threat, he makes a fair few tackles and tries to run the ball his fair share but there’s just no impact, never hits the gaps, never knows how to create momentum, is slow in the ruck and just doesn’t look cut out for an 80 minute NRL second rower, maybe Howarth, Chan or Eisenhuth need to get a shot there?
I'm a huge fan, officially on the Trent train, but, I agree with the bloody awful stupid penalties he gives away. It's like he losing the count, "get off him" you'll hear me shouting at Trent (at the game and on TV!)
Katoa - was quiet against Manly but has been very good I think, he is a threat, works hard, busts the line and is one of the better players this year, exciting to see how he can improve.
Seems very slow in the play the ball but as an 80 minute player I think he's good. Only has improvement in him.
King - Another that was quiet against Manly but has been phenomenal, exceeded all my expectation this season, always puts in effort and shows pride in the jersey, does alot of the dirty work and can’t complain about his form.
At times is good, at times, not so much. Seems to have improved from last year
Garlick - has been ok but isn’t much of an impact, would we be better with a more electric bench player? Sua maybe?
McDonald - tries hard and gets involved but just doesn’t offer much, is awkward and always looks like he is about to make a mistake, gets pinged for a lot of discipline issue as well, not sure he is first grade level either.
I reckon he comes on with great enthusiasm, something sadly lacking from many others
Sims - been pretty average, not as much impact as I’d hoped but he also hasn’t got a lot of minutes, coming off injury I’ll give the benefit of the doubt until a few more games in to judge.
Looks lost out there. Doesn't hit with force in attack or defence. Is his contract loaded with penalty clauses? Looks to be reticent
Eisenhuth - Was really impressed with him vs Manly, might not always be flashy but he is a tough awkward player who can create, maybe give him a start in the pack?
Coming along and consistently surprises me, as with many defences
Overall I think we have been ok to start the year, when we are on like vs South’s and Roosters we were great but there’s been games where we really look like we just can’t be bothered, lazy efforts and no real urgency to turn a game that’s not going smoothly, vs Bulldogs and Manly especially we just waited for someone else to do the hard work and create something, overall I think Olam, Coates, Hughes, Tui, Trent all really need to lift, obviously with Paps and NAS coming back in soon we get a lot of star power back, but it’s really an attitude adjustment we need, drifting out of games this early in the season is worrying and I’m not sure we are in the for the grind, 20 rounds til the finals and we look spent already, thoughts?
Overall, I think coaching styles evolve, maybe ours hasn't? Lack of depth maybe an issue but we rarely bring players back through the reserves and I think this is a failing.
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Itzbek the Purple
- Hail Storm
- Posts: 389
- Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2010 8:56 pm
Totally agree about Olam as under the new interpretations combined with his reputation and his kamikaze tackling style he could easily become more of a liability then asset.
The issues with Hughes and Grant are very dependant on whether the forwards are bending the line and the reffing interpretations . They seem to want to make things happen when things are not going out way and more often than not, its the wrong decision. BTW , was Gee the ref that Brandon Smith gave a blast to which didn't turn out well.
Munster now is a great 5/8 but his lack of speed at full back is really being found out.
Is Welch the best captain? I'm 50/50 on that because I'd rate him much higher than last years model for communication but personally I have an issue with captains who only spend 40 - 60 mins on the ground.
I thought that Tui was a much better bench impact prop that a starter.
Garlick I see as insurance more than effect. His ability to play both second row or emergency 9 probably is the reason he's getting time. Players like Wishart , Anderson or McDonald strike me as honest toilers but not game breakers. It seems to show, in my opinion, that the was vaunted quality in the reserves is just not there at the moment.
The issues with Hughes and Grant are very dependant on whether the forwards are bending the line and the reffing interpretations . They seem to want to make things happen when things are not going out way and more often than not, its the wrong decision. BTW , was Gee the ref that Brandon Smith gave a blast to which didn't turn out well.
Munster now is a great 5/8 but his lack of speed at full back is really being found out.
Is Welch the best captain? I'm 50/50 on that because I'd rate him much higher than last years model for communication but personally I have an issue with captains who only spend 40 - 60 mins on the ground.
I thought that Tui was a much better bench impact prop that a starter.
Garlick I see as insurance more than effect. His ability to play both second row or emergency 9 probably is the reason he's getting time. Players like Wishart , Anderson or McDonald strike me as honest toilers but not game breakers. It seems to show, in my opinion, that the was vaunted quality in the reserves is just not there at the moment.
I think you expect too much from players like Smith, Trent etc. Not every player needs to be a genuine attacking threat. Smith is one of the best defensive centres in the comp and has been great for us this year. Starting to form a nice combination with Warbrick as well. They looked good against Manly, probably our two best.
Trent is definitely an interesting one though. His discipline is absolutely terrible but I really liked what I saw from him against the Tigers, Rabbitohs and Roosters. If he can cut down the errors and penalties then I have no problem with him being in the side.
Agree with what you said about Olam, Hughes, Coates and Tui. All have been below par this year and definitely need to improve.
Trent is definitely an interesting one though. His discipline is absolutely terrible but I really liked what I saw from him against the Tigers, Rabbitohs and Roosters. If he can cut down the errors and penalties then I have no problem with him being in the side.
Agree with what you said about Olam, Hughes, Coates and Tui. All have been below par this year and definitely need to improve.
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SunshineCoastStormer
- Squall
- Posts: 219
- Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2017 5:27 pm
A very thought provoking post.
What I would I factor into player reviews are the losses of the Broms/Kafusi for leadership with the spark of the Cheese and K Brom (down the left) also being missed. Plus we up until the last few weeks have had a boatload of injuries. Missing Munster for 2 games was the biggest injury impact.
Having said that my ratings match the above assessments more or less.
Meaney 9
Warbrick 7
Smith 7
Olam 6
Coates 6
Munster 9
Hughes 7
Welch 7
Grant 9
Sofa 7
Loreiro 7
Katoa 8
King 8
Tui 7
Garlick 7
Sims 5
McDonald 6
Eisenhuth 7
Pezet 8
Anderson 5
Wishart 5
I don’t overly expect Moreira and Howarth would make huge differences but seeing them wouldn’t hurt. I’d love to see Fa’alongo get a run
What I would I factor into player reviews are the losses of the Broms/Kafusi for leadership with the spark of the Cheese and K Brom (down the left) also being missed. Plus we up until the last few weeks have had a boatload of injuries. Missing Munster for 2 games was the biggest injury impact.
Having said that my ratings match the above assessments more or less.
Meaney 9
Warbrick 7
Smith 7
Olam 6
Coates 6
Munster 9
Hughes 7
Welch 7
Grant 9
Sofa 7
Loreiro 7
Katoa 8
King 8
Tui 7
Garlick 7
Sims 5
McDonald 6
Eisenhuth 7
Pezet 8
Anderson 5
Wishart 5
I don’t overly expect Moreira and Howarth would make huge differences but seeing them wouldn’t hurt. I’d love to see Fa’alongo get a run
I think the assessment is fair, but is it based upon attack or defence?
I rate Smith quite highly in defence and when a player has been tackled once by Olam they tend to be a bit reluctant the next time.
When you have have had 2 backrowers in you defensive line like Kenny and Fuss combinations work without saying. Katoa is a natural, but Loriero is developing.
The players I am most disappointed in is Sims and Wishart. Sims because his defence is non existant ans Wishart because they can't find permanent spot for him so he acts like a duck out of water most of the time, Garlick is a better utility player and punches above his weight.
You also can tell when Eisenhuth is playing, he settles the group and is just starting to come into form. He just has to stop being injured all the time.
You didn't mention Pene who knows he wants to be in first grade and had an outstanding match against the warriors. If he becomes consistent I would drop Sims and leave Pene in the bench.
I rate Smith quite highly in defence and when a player has been tackled once by Olam they tend to be a bit reluctant the next time.
When you have have had 2 backrowers in you defensive line like Kenny and Fuss combinations work without saying. Katoa is a natural, but Loriero is developing.
The players I am most disappointed in is Sims and Wishart. Sims because his defence is non existant ans Wishart because they can't find permanent spot for him so he acts like a duck out of water most of the time, Garlick is a better utility player and punches above his weight.
You also can tell when Eisenhuth is playing, he settles the group and is just starting to come into form. He just has to stop being injured all the time.
You didn't mention Pene who knows he wants to be in first grade and had an outstanding match against the warriors. If he becomes consistent I would drop Sims and leave Pene in the bench.